I have an active running DSC alarm (PC1616) and monitored to Central Station.
It is monitored through phone lines.
I want IP access to the alarm from my iPhone, iPad, MacBook Pro.
I have no PCs in my house.
I am seriously looking at this EnvisaLink-3. I like all the items it seems to handle.
I think it is a 'home run' in IP access to my alarm system, and the price is right.
However, I want to introduce/install some home automation in my house.
- first off, I want a Programable Thermostat I can access via IP through this system
- eventually I want to install one or two exterior motion cameras
- eventually I want two interior cameras that have two way audio for communication (talk and listen)
- eventually some controlled lights. When motions sensors are triggered in an area, I can have those lights turned on.
So first is getting the PC1616 configured with the EnvisaLink-3 and getting the Thermostat to work with that. That seems simple.
I was considering the iT100 DSC Serial Integration module first, but their installation manuals all need the secret handshake to get a copy of and there is no direct support for the average home owner without hiring one of their installers. The EnvisaLink-3 is third party and appears to have all kinds of support. So I am leaning the way of the EnvisaLink-3
I have been leaning away from Z-Wave stuff. I have simply read to many bad reviews all over the net.
I have been looking at INSTEON products. I have been considering the 2441TH - INSTEON 7 Day Programmable Thermostat.
But not sure how to make them all talk. It does not look like the EnvisaLink-3 will talk directly to the INSTEON thermostat.
Looks like I need a controller with this setup. Some of these controllers look pretty complicated. I am considering the
ISY-99i PRO INSTEON Compatible Automation Controller with Dual-Band PLM
It is compatible with all the INSTEON components.
I am assuming the EnvisaLink-3 will communicate with this controller ?
I am DIY guy with decent electrical and computer capabilities. I am sure if I get these components figured out I get get this set up. I have some minimal computer programming background as well. Mostly LISP.
I don't want a system that I have to be a computer programer to get it to work.
Does anyone have a setup like this? Am I on the right track ?
I am assuming I will have an IP website for the Alarm and another for the INSTEON thermostat and other components. Or can I set this up to run from one IP website. It would be nice to have it all run from the same webpage, but not a requirements
I greatly appreciate anyone's help here. There are so many components and options and no manuals on-line to read to see if you are getting compatible equipment that will work in the manner you want.
Cheers
Kevin
EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Moderators: EyezOnRich, GrandWizard
-
GrandWizard
- Posts: 2320
- Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 4:08 pm
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Hi,
Your camera support is available through the Eyezon portal but unless you can find a used EMS-100 somewhere, you won't be able to directly control your thermostat at this time.
For Universal Devices you need the DSCLink software (free) that integrates with the Envisalink. This unfortunately runs on a PC so you need to have a computer running all the time to support this.
Alternately look at the Micasaverde VERA product. It has native Z-wave but you can buy an Insteon USB modem for it. We have a large number of Envisalink customers using VERA.
There are other HA systems that support the Envisalink too.
Your camera support is available through the Eyezon portal but unless you can find a used EMS-100 somewhere, you won't be able to directly control your thermostat at this time.
For Universal Devices you need the DSCLink software (free) that integrates with the Envisalink. This unfortunately runs on a PC so you need to have a computer running all the time to support this.
Alternately look at the Micasaverde VERA product. It has native Z-wave but you can buy an Insteon USB modem for it. We have a large number of Envisalink customers using VERA.
There are other HA systems that support the Envisalink too.
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Thanks for the reply.
OK so camera and alarm access and control are easy. One less thing to worry about. Great!
You noted, I needed an older EMS-100,(searched that on E-bay, nothing looked correct) or I won't be able to remote control my thermostat at this time. Is thermostat control something that is coming? If so how long before release? Possibly by a software update to the EnvisaLink-3? Probably too far off anyways!
Ya.. having a Windows computer running 24/7 is not an option for me. So not an option there.
Usually I am not a big fan of the universal devices. If I can get away from them I will. Usually universal devices (while often very effective) require more knowledge and more fussing around to get stuff to work. So I have been looking at other options. Something more plug and play so to speak.
I have discovered this new INSTEON HUB. I like that, as it controls all off the INSTEON stuff in one spot. It will do everything; switches, cameras, sprinkler system, water sensors, etc. All one manufacturer less fuss.
http://www.insteon.net/2242-222-insteon-hub.html
That would possibly leave me 2 APPs and 2 IPs to run my full system. One APP for the alarm and the other for all the INSTEON stuff. That might be ok. I guess. They wouldn't talk, but I was hoping to have my alarm (when tripped) signal and turn on lights, but maybe not that big of a deal. I could just have the motions sensors switch the lights on motion I guess. One trigger might happen nefore the other, but maybe not a big deal.
However the INSTEON HUB says it is compatible with many security systems and even X10 communications. Is the EnvisaLink-3 compatible with the INSTEON HUB ? Do they talk ?
So if the EnvisaLink-3 will output/receive/relay communications (x10, etc) from the PC1616 to the INSTEON HUB I might get them talking.
Then I could control ALL from the INSTEON HUB under one APP .
The INSTEON HUB also states that it supports any device with a 256x10 address.
Does the EnvisaLink-3 have a 256x10 address ?
Maybe it would work through the 256x10 address.
I might even consider the EnvisaLink-3 and the INSTEON HUB (in two different APPS) if I new they would be able to communicate sometime in the future.
Then again, it sound like the EnvisaLink-3 will do everything I want other than the thermostat.
Would EnvisaLink-3 handle the switches, sprinkler system and water sensors?
So I could go that way and just go buy the HoneyWell Thermostat that has web access to control that for $150. Still 2 APPS. Thinking I still need the VERA and INSTEON modem to run the other INSTEON components?
Your help is greatly appreciated!
I am going to go look at the VERA stuff right now.
Options!
OK so camera and alarm access and control are easy. One less thing to worry about. Great!
You noted, I needed an older EMS-100,(searched that on E-bay, nothing looked correct) or I won't be able to remote control my thermostat at this time. Is thermostat control something that is coming? If so how long before release? Possibly by a software update to the EnvisaLink-3? Probably too far off anyways!
Ya.. having a Windows computer running 24/7 is not an option for me. So not an option there.
Usually I am not a big fan of the universal devices. If I can get away from them I will. Usually universal devices (while often very effective) require more knowledge and more fussing around to get stuff to work. So I have been looking at other options. Something more plug and play so to speak.
I have discovered this new INSTEON HUB. I like that, as it controls all off the INSTEON stuff in one spot. It will do everything; switches, cameras, sprinkler system, water sensors, etc. All one manufacturer less fuss.
http://www.insteon.net/2242-222-insteon-hub.html
That would possibly leave me 2 APPs and 2 IPs to run my full system. One APP for the alarm and the other for all the INSTEON stuff. That might be ok. I guess. They wouldn't talk, but I was hoping to have my alarm (when tripped) signal and turn on lights, but maybe not that big of a deal. I could just have the motions sensors switch the lights on motion I guess. One trigger might happen nefore the other, but maybe not a big deal.
However the INSTEON HUB says it is compatible with many security systems and even X10 communications. Is the EnvisaLink-3 compatible with the INSTEON HUB ? Do they talk ?
So if the EnvisaLink-3 will output/receive/relay communications (x10, etc) from the PC1616 to the INSTEON HUB I might get them talking.
Then I could control ALL from the INSTEON HUB under one APP .
The INSTEON HUB also states that it supports any device with a 256x10 address.
Does the EnvisaLink-3 have a 256x10 address ?
Maybe it would work through the 256x10 address.
I might even consider the EnvisaLink-3 and the INSTEON HUB (in two different APPS) if I new they would be able to communicate sometime in the future.
Then again, it sound like the EnvisaLink-3 will do everything I want other than the thermostat.
Would EnvisaLink-3 handle the switches, sprinkler system and water sensors?
So I could go that way and just go buy the HoneyWell Thermostat that has web access to control that for $150. Still 2 APPS. Thinking I still need the VERA and INSTEON modem to run the other INSTEON components?
Your help is greatly appreciated!
I am going to go look at the VERA stuff right now.
Options!
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Just looked at the VERA site. Looks interesting. Seems a little back door-ish to go EnvisaLink-3, then VERA, then go back INSTEON modem to get the INSTEON stuff to work.
What does HoneyWell have that would talk with the EnvisaLink-3 and control all its own Honeywell switches and thermostats, etc? I imagine HoneyWell is expensive.
Just trying to sort lout all my option.
Still liking the EnvisaLink-3 and the INSTEON HUB. Very affordable.
They will work well as separate entities, but would be better if I could get them all talking.
I wonder of at a later date if I bought the VERA controller if it would talk to the INSTEON HUB and work as a modem if I decided I really needed them to talk to each other
So many things to consider !
Kev
What does HoneyWell have that would talk with the EnvisaLink-3 and control all its own Honeywell switches and thermostats, etc? I imagine HoneyWell is expensive.
Just trying to sort lout all my option.
Still liking the EnvisaLink-3 and the INSTEON HUB. Very affordable.
They will work well as separate entities, but would be better if I could get them all talking.
I wonder of at a later date if I bought the VERA controller if it would talk to the INSTEON HUB and work as a modem if I decided I really needed them to talk to each other
So many things to consider !
Kev
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Hi Kev - the CT30 aka 3M50 radio thermostat is about $100 at home depot, and they've got a cloud service you can access from a browser similar to eyezon with android and iphone apps. So 2 apps, 2 devices (envisalink and radiothermostat) and you're good to go. Both can be directly accessed through an API in addition to the cloud services, but only for internal automation - the APIs can't be safely exposed outside of your firewall.
Mike
Mike
DscServer for android/linux/windows: https://sites.google.com/site/mppsuite/dscserver
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
I am leaning towards to the EnvisaLink-3 and the INSTEON HUB. As I want the INSTEON Thermostat, switches, floor floor sensor, heat sensor, sprinkler system control and rain sensors. Just one nice big package.
Still two separate systems though.
On the EnvisaLink-3, when a camera activates does it signal a text to the APP (iPhone) immediately or does it waiting until the DSC times out and makes its call to Central Station. There is a 2 minute delay on my DSC alarm.
I might set up all the cameras on the INSTEON and have that text me upon activation, But I guess I still have to activate the INSTEON HUB into monitor mode, otherwise the cameras would be going off all day long.
So activating and de-activating two systems. That's a pain.
I guies that is what the VERA controller is for.
I wonder if the VERA Controller will talk to the INSTEON HUB.
Kev
Still two separate systems though.
On the EnvisaLink-3, when a camera activates does it signal a text to the APP (iPhone) immediately or does it waiting until the DSC times out and makes its call to Central Station. There is a 2 minute delay on my DSC alarm.
I might set up all the cameras on the INSTEON and have that text me upon activation, But I guess I still have to activate the INSTEON HUB into monitor mode, otherwise the cameras would be going off all day long.
So activating and de-activating two systems. That's a pain.
I guies that is what the VERA controller is for.
I wonder if the VERA Controller will talk to the INSTEON HUB.
Kev
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
I use a full Insteon system in my house and have a PC1832.
Personally, I wouldn't think of purchasing Insteon without owning an ISY994i. It makes programming/managing Insteon soooo much easier. Plus the support on their forum is second to none.
It's interface isn't as "pretty" as say Veras or the Hub, but I don't really care.
Security cameras can be connected to the Eyez-On portal, any of the Insteon thermostats can be accessed from the ISY's.
All your DSC status info can be pulled into the ISY using the DSCLink program (I'm actually the author). GrandWizard mentioned it needs a computer which is true, however I run it off a Raspberry Pi ($35 and a couple watts electricity) and it works great.
Don't rule out the ISY until you visit their forums and see what I mean.
Personally, I wouldn't think of purchasing Insteon without owning an ISY994i. It makes programming/managing Insteon soooo much easier. Plus the support on their forum is second to none.
It's interface isn't as "pretty" as say Veras or the Hub, but I don't really care.
Security cameras can be connected to the Eyez-On portal, any of the Insteon thermostats can be accessed from the ISY's.
All your DSC status info can be pulled into the ISY using the DSCLink program (I'm actually the author). GrandWizard mentioned it needs a computer which is true, however I run it off a Raspberry Pi ($35 and a couple watts electricity) and it works great.
Don't rule out the ISY until you visit their forums and see what I mean.
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Hi io_guy, thanks
My issue with the ISY was having to run a windows computer 24/7.
I run all Mac in my house, so not an option.
This Raspberry PI looks very interesting. Model B for $35
I see there are three operating system available. I have not used either one.
I have re-built my own dos/windows computer, networks, replacing /adding computer parts, full format and reload, etc and recently switched to Mac with Parallels7 and becoming more familiar with the Mac iOS, but I am not a computer programmer, other than AUTOLISP for AUTOCAD.
I have started doing some Terminal commands in the Mac iOS, and light programming through Sleep Watcher, but pretty lost there. Generally copying stuff off of the net with minimal modifications. But I have been able to complete what I was trying to do. Therefore if there are good examples I think I could follow it through to set it up.
I see they note that they say there are some who sell the preloaded SD cards. Know anyone who could do this and possibly even load and set up the DSClink software? If I have issues beyond my capabilities.
Then again, if I cannot figure out how to set it up, I will likely have troubles trouble shoot moving forward.
This could be a bit of a jump for me. I am interested though!
The ISY would also allow me to use different companies components if I so wanted.
So far I see everything I want at INSTEON.
I have been reading a lot of INSTEON reviews/forums/etc and INSTEON gets pretty beaten up out there by many previous users. Most of those bashing forums seem to stop around late 2010. Seems maybe INSTEON has resolved many of these issues since then. The greater percent of posts I have read dated 2011 to date have been pretty positive. Yes, the odd components crap out, but cost wise a serious bang for your buck as a system. Even you, io_guy seem pretty happy with the INSTEON products.
I feel fairly confident in investing in the INSTEON products.
I am going to go check out the ISY Forum as well.
I just Googled the DSClink software and it doesn't come up.
Where can I find this ? Does it require programming language skills to set up?
This new INSTEON HUB for +/-$150 is a pretty cheap investment if it turns out to be a brick. I guess for simplicity I keep leaning back to it. I guess I keep thinking that this is a new product for INSTEON and I am hoping that maybe they have improved their in-house functionality, connectivity and management. Again hoping they have simplified the event/action management programming. I keep thinking that, well everyone as well as INSTEON seem to lean to the ISY controllers, maybe this is INSTEON's stab at getting that business back and simplifying their system. Here's hoping !!!
I have not committed to anything yet, other than the EnvisaLink-3. I think that is a must.
Going to order my first components for my system right after the new year. So I have a few days yet to complete more research and answer more questions.
Thanks for your comments.
My issue with the ISY was having to run a windows computer 24/7.
I run all Mac in my house, so not an option.
This Raspberry PI looks very interesting. Model B for $35
I see there are three operating system available. I have not used either one.
I have re-built my own dos/windows computer, networks, replacing /adding computer parts, full format and reload, etc and recently switched to Mac with Parallels7 and becoming more familiar with the Mac iOS, but I am not a computer programmer, other than AUTOLISP for AUTOCAD.
I have started doing some Terminal commands in the Mac iOS, and light programming through Sleep Watcher, but pretty lost there. Generally copying stuff off of the net with minimal modifications. But I have been able to complete what I was trying to do. Therefore if there are good examples I think I could follow it through to set it up.
I see they note that they say there are some who sell the preloaded SD cards. Know anyone who could do this and possibly even load and set up the DSClink software? If I have issues beyond my capabilities.
Then again, if I cannot figure out how to set it up, I will likely have troubles trouble shoot moving forward.
This could be a bit of a jump for me. I am interested though!
The ISY would also allow me to use different companies components if I so wanted.
So far I see everything I want at INSTEON.
I have been reading a lot of INSTEON reviews/forums/etc and INSTEON gets pretty beaten up out there by many previous users. Most of those bashing forums seem to stop around late 2010. Seems maybe INSTEON has resolved many of these issues since then. The greater percent of posts I have read dated 2011 to date have been pretty positive. Yes, the odd components crap out, but cost wise a serious bang for your buck as a system. Even you, io_guy seem pretty happy with the INSTEON products.
I feel fairly confident in investing in the INSTEON products.
I am going to go check out the ISY Forum as well.
I just Googled the DSClink software and it doesn't come up.
Where can I find this ? Does it require programming language skills to set up?
This new INSTEON HUB for +/-$150 is a pretty cheap investment if it turns out to be a brick. I guess for simplicity I keep leaning back to it. I guess I keep thinking that this is a new product for INSTEON and I am hoping that maybe they have improved their in-house functionality, connectivity and management. Again hoping they have simplified the event/action management programming. I keep thinking that, well everyone as well as INSTEON seem to lean to the ISY controllers, maybe this is INSTEON's stab at getting that business back and simplifying their system. Here's hoping !!!
I have not committed to anything yet, other than the EnvisaLink-3. I think that is a must.
Going to order my first components for my system right after the new year. So I have a few days yet to complete more research and answer more questions.
Thanks for your comments.
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
Well I have more answers.... Spoke to INSTEON
The HUB does not do LOGIC.
With the HUB
I can have a motion sensor trip, and on that action turn on some lights.
If I have a rain sensor, I cannot tell the HUB to turn off the irrigation system as that it LOGIC
If I have a floor water sensor trigger, it can show a trigger, but I don't think it can warn me via text or email.
If I have a thermostat and I want into notify me if the temperature drops below a certain temperature to warn me of a failed heating system, that is LOGIC as well.
So I guess I need a ISY as opposed to the HUB.
Going to have to figure out this Raspberry Pi and DSClink software I guess. I might need your help io_guy, if you are up for it ?
How do you deal, with video recording when you are away. I have a 1T network drive in the house with RAID, but not sure I want that loading with Video recordings as my office is all on there. I could set up another Netdrive or use a web service, but don't want to have monthly fees. Think the Netdrive might be a better option.
How big would that drive have to be?
Set up the net drive to delete all video files that are a month old or more. I think a month would be good as I might be away for three weeks or something. That could be a lot of video! I guess it would only have to record video when the DSC alarm is in ARMED mode. That would reduce the amount of video.
Here is the catch. I take my computer with me when I go way, so recording software on my Mac cannot run.
Can I run the recording software on the Raspberry? The windows or MAc programs may not run on there. Hmm...
Maybe a web service is best for that ! I wonder if I could record that to DROPBOX?
Need to learn more bout these cameras now....
Sorry, lots of DIY questions, but I am getting closer to my solution. Thanks for your help.
Kevin's buying a
EnvisaLink-3
ISY994iR
Insteon 2441TH Thermostat
2 Floor sensors #24950A3, one by furnace and the other upstairs near the washing machine
Going to need the Raspberry Pi
DSClink software
to start with and a bunch of time.......
eventually buy...
Rain sensor #2852
sprinkler controller
cameras
switches
and likely more..... as time goes on and keep building...
The HUB does not do LOGIC.
With the HUB
I can have a motion sensor trip, and on that action turn on some lights.
If I have a rain sensor, I cannot tell the HUB to turn off the irrigation system as that it LOGIC
If I have a floor water sensor trigger, it can show a trigger, but I don't think it can warn me via text or email.
If I have a thermostat and I want into notify me if the temperature drops below a certain temperature to warn me of a failed heating system, that is LOGIC as well.
So I guess I need a ISY as opposed to the HUB.
Going to have to figure out this Raspberry Pi and DSClink software I guess. I might need your help io_guy, if you are up for it ?
How do you deal, with video recording when you are away. I have a 1T network drive in the house with RAID, but not sure I want that loading with Video recordings as my office is all on there. I could set up another Netdrive or use a web service, but don't want to have monthly fees. Think the Netdrive might be a better option.
How big would that drive have to be?
Set up the net drive to delete all video files that are a month old or more. I think a month would be good as I might be away for three weeks or something. That could be a lot of video! I guess it would only have to record video when the DSC alarm is in ARMED mode. That would reduce the amount of video.
Here is the catch. I take my computer with me when I go way, so recording software on my Mac cannot run.
Can I run the recording software on the Raspberry? The windows or MAc programs may not run on there. Hmm...
Maybe a web service is best for that ! I wonder if I could record that to DROPBOX?
Need to learn more bout these cameras now....
Sorry, lots of DIY questions, but I am getting closer to my solution. Thanks for your help.
Kevin's buying a
EnvisaLink-3
ISY994iR
Insteon 2441TH Thermostat
2 Floor sensors #24950A3, one by furnace and the other upstairs near the washing machine
Going to need the Raspberry Pi
DSClink software
to start with and a bunch of time.......
eventually buy...
Rain sensor #2852
sprinkler controller
cameras
switches
and likely more..... as time goes on and keep building...
Re: EnvisaLink-3 and DSC PC1616
So I'll probably miss a couple of your questions here...
The ISY does not need a computer to run at all - only to program.
You would need a computer to run DSCLink, if you wanted to do that. I use a Pi but it will actually run on Mac as well (under mono).
My Pi has arch linux installed:
http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv6/raspberry-pi
DSCLink is here (requires no programming skills):
http://automationshack.com/dsclink.html
Forum is here:
http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewforum.php?f=58
My video recordings go onto my NAS (and some to the cloud but that's getting off point). A 1TB drive should be ample space, but it really depends on the bitrate you set your video to. You won't be able to use the Pi to store recordings.
As for Insteon, any of the protocols (UPB, Z-wave, Insteon, etc) will have quirks. Insteon has certainly had its share but things have been quite good of late. You may find some appliance in your house causing noise but this can generally be filtered out. A large number of Insteon devices are now dual-band (powerline and RF) which has definitely made a positive impact on reliability.
Your purchase list is a good starting point. That's what I did, start with the basics and then continue to add more devices. Beware though - once you start it is very addictive. I have everything but the kitchen sink hooked in now (bug zapper, deck lights, smoke detectors, garage doors, temperature sensors, fireplace, door bell, alarm system, etc).
The ISY does not need a computer to run at all - only to program.
You would need a computer to run DSCLink, if you wanted to do that. I use a Pi but it will actually run on Mac as well (under mono).
My Pi has arch linux installed:
http://archlinuxarm.org/platforms/armv6/raspberry-pi
DSCLink is here (requires no programming skills):
http://automationshack.com/dsclink.html
Forum is here:
http://forum.universal-devices.com/viewforum.php?f=58
My video recordings go onto my NAS (and some to the cloud but that's getting off point). A 1TB drive should be ample space, but it really depends on the bitrate you set your video to. You won't be able to use the Pi to store recordings.
As for Insteon, any of the protocols (UPB, Z-wave, Insteon, etc) will have quirks. Insteon has certainly had its share but things have been quite good of late. You may find some appliance in your house causing noise but this can generally be filtered out. A large number of Insteon devices are now dual-band (powerline and RF) which has definitely made a positive impact on reliability.
Your purchase list is a good starting point. That's what I did, start with the basics and then continue to add more devices. Beware though - once you start it is very addictive. I have everything but the kitchen sink hooked in now (bug zapper, deck lights, smoke detectors, garage doors, temperature sensors, fireplace, door bell, alarm system, etc).